Choice Part 2: Bigger Pie

Another fundamental difference in how I experience sexuality, is that the discovery of my attraction to women (in my thirties) did not in any way diminish my attraction to men. The pie went from being baked in an 8 inch pie pan to a 10 inch pie pan. This was an addition not a transition or a denial of who I was fundamentally. There wasn't a feeling of loss, sadness, guilt or shame. It was just a very interesting new facet of who I am. Since I'm fully satisfied with the original pie, and to tell you the truth, well satiated, I don't feel the need to eat the rest of the pie, but it's definitely there. I'm now approaching twenty years of experience (and several unique incidents of attraction) without further expansion of the pie or reduction of the underlying attraction to men, I doubt that there will be further transition to a more gay state of being and I think the phrase "something more that straight" is a fairly apt description of me. I could choose to eat the other parts of my pie, but I don't for religious reasons.

Straight Talk to Consider for LDS Women: "Princess?"

It's no secret that I have a problem with Drama Queens, women who blame the church for their problems and persons, in general, who do not wish to be accountable for their own choices. I blogged about my admiration for Queen Elizabeth II and what a solid role model for mature, yes even LDS, womanhood she is. So I'd like to consider the following points from "You are not a princess 25 points for women and men to consider":

My responses are in Italics

1. You are not a princess. You do not deserve to be treated like royalty just by virtue of your sex. You deserve to be treated no better or worse than you treat others.

We are all sons and daughters of a King (and Queen, don't forget), remember the golden rule and the first commandment. The hardest place to apply this principle is in personal relationships. But if you find yourself falling into expectations wherein you think you deserve more because you are female-think about it. Please.

2. You are not any more “special” nor any more “entitled” than anyone else. You don’t deserve special privileges and nobody “owes” you anything by virtue of who you are or because of your gender.

I agree, along with the caveat of we are all special. When a male does show a woman traditional grace notes of opening doors, speaking kindly, please reciprocate with the traditionally appropriate thank you and other arts of graceful living.

3. You are just as “lucky” to have found your husband/boyfriend as he was to find you. Have you ever considered that there are times when you are lucky that he puts up with and tolerates you?

It is great fortune when a person finds the love of their life. But some partners are more blessed when others because the reality is that few relationships are 50/50 all the time, and there are ebbs and flows. It's nice to be evenly yoked but most marriages, partnerships and relationships are not that way. But it's probably better in many cases than pulling alone and when its not, well perhaps its time to go your own way.

4. Men have feelings, too. They hurt just as much as you do when you criticize, reject, dismiss, ignore, make fun of, disrespect, invalidate and/or mock them. In fact, they may hurt more because they don’t have as many emotional outlets as you—especially if you tell him his feelings “don’t count” or to “be a man” when he expresses his feelings that you mistakenly claim he doesn’t have and/or is “wrong” for having. He has feelings and he has a right to them even when they’re not the same as yours and/or are expressed differently than you express yours.

I've seen some terrible stuff along these lines from women, but men also do the same to women and some partners do this to each other. I don't think this is a uniquely princess failure.

5. If it’s okay for you to have male friends and maintain friendships with your exes, it’s also okay for your husband/boyfriend to have female friends and maintain friendships with his exes. It is not different for you because “you’re a woman.” It’s faulty logic to suppose women are inherently more trustworthy than men. This is called a double standard and it’s not okay. Otherwise, the culturally acceptable pronouncement, “Men are all dogs” should be met with “Women are all bitches” (i.e., female dogs) and should be equally culturally acceptable.

I agree, but note that we as LDS people probably exercise more caution in these relationships outside of the current marriage, partnership or relationship. On the other hand, we of all people, should be best equipped to have solid friendships with others including our ex's due to the twin principles of repentence and forgiveness. Note that I said "should" sometimes its just not humanly possible.


6. A father is just as important in a child’s life as a mother. Period. Just because you have a uterus doesn’t make you the better parent by default.

Well, this is an interesting argument for a Moho blog isn't it? I will agree that the optimum configuration for a family IS a mother and a father. The proclamation for the family also supports this family configuration. The question arises when a traditional (mother/father) family breaks up who is the better parent? It's not really relevant legally, because the law looks at what's best for the child. And, when you use that as your defining calculus, things change significantly. As a society we no longer dispose of fathers. Period. Because they are important to children. So is anyone who is important in the life of a child, both same sex parents, stepparents(I've seen it) and biological parent's exes.

7. Children are not “hers” and “his” objects. The correct possessive pronoun is “ours.”

Exactly.

8. Your husband/boyfriend does not “owe” you. He shouldn’t be expected to financially support you and shower you with gifts unless you’re willing to reciprocate and equally support him without question or complaint. You’re neither his child nor his dependent. You’re supposed to be his equal partner.

This brings up the question of the disposable LDS husband who is dumped because he is not a good provider through no fault of his own. Quite frankly, I've seen this way too many times. You may not have wanted to work, but if your husband is underemployed but diligent, stalwart and doing other things he needs to do, this is not a basis for destroying a family. Yes, my dear, you do need to seek employment or be willing to give up the second car and the scrapbooking hobby.

During times of prolonged unemployment as in the current he-cession will you support him by going out and getting a job of your own, taking a second or third job (as he would have) or will you fall back on the notion that it is not your role as an LDS woman because you have children?

If he's hurt, injured, mentally ill or just left behind by the workforce, will you pick up the slack with a cheerful heart?

9. Your husband’s/boyfriend’s desires, needs, wishes, feelings, likes and dislikes are just as important as yours. It’s not all about you all the time. You’re supposedly in a mutual and reciprocal relationship; not a service industry/client-vendor relationship.

10. If you’re not willing to make changes in yourself and your behavior, you’ve no right to demand that your husband/boyfriend do so. Nor is it reasonable to demand or expect your husband/boyfriend to make all the changes you want first before you’re willing to do your own work.

11. You are not a better human being by virtue of being a woman. You’re not a goddess. You’re not a sacred cow. You don’t “rule.” You’re a person, just like your husband/boyfriend is a person. You both deserve to be treated with equal dignity and respect when you act and treat each other with dignity and respect.

This is that strange place of bifurcation within the LDS church where women are placed on a pedestal due to their roles as mothers and men as their roles as priesthood bearers. Is one really better than the other and if you could see the dichotomy as equal dignity and respect how would that change things? I can see LDS feminists rewriting this statement as "You are not a better human being by virtue of being a man, . . . "

12. It’s a lie and a manipulation to say you “sacrificed” your career when you never really wanted to work in the first place. If you see your husband/boyfriend as your ticket to freedom from being a wage slave, be honest with yourself and your husband/boyfriend and most important of all, BE GRATEFUL. Having another person pay your way through life is not an inalienable right; it’s an enormous gift for which you should express gratitude on a regular basis.

It's also a lie and manipulation to say that you really wanted to stay home but couldn't afford to when you are working to afford a home that the majority of the inhabitants of the world would call a mansion.

It's a further lie and manipulations to say that you didn't pursue employment or educational opportunities because of your spouse, kids or the LDS church's stance on women working. These were your choices as many, many, many LDS women's careers now demonstrate.

Please do be grateful for the hard work of your spouse or partner when you have been able to have the luxury of staying home. This is particularly true if you have had the remarkable opportunity to care for your own children in their own home. This is something I wish I could desperately give my husband and baby song next year when he is the remaining child in our home, but I cannot. We have a situation where this would be the optimum for the three of us. I appreciate the handful of times I've been able to do it and my husband went off to work without ever complaining and has been unemployed less than .25% of the time we have been married. He is remarkable for that fact alone.

13. It is wrong to use your child(ren) to hurt, control or extort money from your husband/boyfriend/ex. In fact, it borders on child abuse. Children are not pawns or human shields to be used for your own selfish reasons. They’re people who will later grow to resent you for using them in this fashion and will likely develop psychological problems of their own as a result.

14. It is wrong to expect or demand that your ex continue to financially support you after the relationship ends. The children are entitled to support until they become adults at the age of 18. You’re already an adult and, as such, you’re capable of and should legally be expected to take care of yourself— unless you’re willing to continue to support your ex by doing his grocery shopping, cooking cleaning, errands, etc. If your obligations to your husband are finished after a divorce, his obligations to you should also be finished.

This depends on the circumstances and the laws where you live. Sometimes Women are required to support an ex after a divorce as well. But, while I cannot agree with this as a blanket statement, yes, part of being accountable is realizing that things change and usually not for the better after a divorce in terms of finances. Divorce and Bankruptcy tend to go hand in hand.

15. Your husband/boyfriend is not responsible for your happiness. It isn’t his job to make you happy; that’s your job. Just as he is responsible for his own happiness. He’s supposed to be your equal partner, not your emotional wet nurse.

Cruelly stated but true.

16. The desire for sex in a committed, loving relationship is healthy and natural. Using sex to control, shame or hurt your husband/boyfriend by withholding affection or making sex transactional is unhealthy and wrong.

Unfortunately, this assumes that only women play this game, but men do too. Respect of boundaries for both parties is also important-remember its possible to force your partner. Also, low libido and sexless relationships are, interestingly, not the sole province of opposite sex marriages, partnerships and relationships.

17. Your husband/boyfriend should be more important to you than your child(ren) just as you should be more important to your husband than the child(ren). In other words, you should be each others’ first priorities; children second. You don’t need a husband if your sole desire is to have children—unless you see the man as a source of income for yourself and the children. If you can’t support yourself, you probably shouldn’t be having children. Marriage is a bond between two grown adults; not a bond between parent and child (Marc Rudov, 2008). You vow to honor your spouse and put him or her before all others, this includes your children. Children eventually fly the coop. If you make them the focus and raison d’être of your marriage, don’t be surprised when you no longer have much of a marriage as the years pass.

18. You are only entitled to what you earn or produce. Men are neither beasts of burden nor “working boys” to be pimped out in the service of their partners or ex-partners. No one owes you a living. As an adult, you’re not entitled to be taken care of by another party unless you have documented cognitive or physical disabilities that prohibit you from working. Last time I checked, being a wife, ex-wife, girlfriend, ex-girlfriend, mistress, ex-mistress, mother and/or simply a woman wasn’t considered a disability.

See my comments under #14.

19. It is just as ABUSIVE when a woman slaps, kicks, hits, spits at, scratches, shoves, pushes, punches, pulls hair, uses a weapon, swings a golf club at or throws objects at a man. It isn’t funny, cute, justifiable or deserved. It is indefensible, inexcusable, criminal and just as prosecutable as when a man acts violently toward a woman. Period.

YES.

20. The same goes for emotional abuse. It is unacceptable.

I would add stalking under this category which can also occur within a marriage I've posted a you tube video also originally spotted by Dr. Tara who wrote these 25 points. This video has PG-13 language, but it is very typical of female stalking of husbands, partners and exes.



21. It is neither “normal” nor “acceptable” adult female behavior to throw temper tantrums, withhold sex, cry, rage, pout, have disproportionate reactions to events or be unable to control emotions and behaviors. At the very least, these are signs of emotional lability and poor impulse control; at worst, these are indicators of serious pathology and quite possibly some kind of personality disorder.

The same is true with certain male sterotypical behaviors as well. I would cut some slack on the crying though, we do a lot of that, both male and female in this culture.

I think we probably as an entire culture and I'm speaking of the complete overculture here need to do a better job at helping our people function emotionally.

22. It is not okay to divert money from your joint checking/savings account(s) or open credit cards in your husband’s/boyfriend’s name without his knowledge and explicit permission. The first instance is stealing and the second is considered identity theft and fraud. Signing your husband’s/boyfriend’s signature to financial and legal documents is forgery. All of these actions are illegal.

I would add that the converse is true as well, but a little less frequent in occurrence. Also you could substitute elderly parents and minor children for husband/boyfriend here as well.

23. It is irresponsible to live beyond your means and abusive to expect your husband/boyfriend to foot the bill or go into debt to cover your expenses. If you can’t responsibly use a credit/debit card then, much like a child, you shouldn’t have one.

24. It is never acceptable or permissible to threaten to deny your husband/boyfriend/ex access to the children you share. It is not okay to make up abuse allegations because you’re feeling angry, hurt or out of control. This is an act of slander (spoken) or libel (written) and if you swear to it in court, it’s also an act of perjury.

This aggravates me to no end when I experience this in my professional life. It is particularly annoying because so many women are actually victimized. Those that choose to lie about abuse make a mockery of the suffering of their sisters.

25. It is not fair to commit to or marry a man and then try to change him. If you don’t accept him as he is, just like you expect him to accept you and your faults, then you have no business being with him. Everyone has a right to feel accepted for who he or she is in a relationship. If he’s “not good enough” for you from the get go; keep looking and cut him loose so he can be with a woman who appreciates him.

Wow. I don't even want to touch 25 in terms of an LDS MOM marriage. But, yes I have to agree with the basis of this statement. And, I also have to state that it is not rational to expect no divergence, no change and no faults in a partner. It pretty much is an uncertain journey.

Stuart Matis-Means Reduction Techniques

One of the difficult and traumatic questions that arises as you read the story of Stuart Matis as told in the book In Quiet Desperation, is why his parents accepted Stuart's purchase of a gun. Stuart's parents address this issue and note that they were afraid of alienating Stuart and they hoped by keeping communication open that might possibly make a difference. Yet, they were also astoundingly fatalistic (which studies show is a common response by family members, friends and even the medical profession) about the potential for Stuart to take his own life and many people have difficulty with their perspective and the context they chose place the events in.

Friends and family can dramatically reduce the incidence of Suicide by removing the guns and pills. How do you do it? I will borrow liberally from the Harvard School of Public Health Means Reduction Website and list the techniques below.

Can you really make a difference by reducing means? Yes.

First, most of the time you can make a difference because the overwhelming majority of suicide attempts are impulsive in nature and 90% of attempters do not go on to die by suicide later. Second, guns in the home are the major source of means for teenagers who commit suicide. Better control, storage or elimination of guns (and, we are actually talking handguns here since hunting weapons are rarely utilized in suicide) from the household is a huge step towards safety in the home for teens, Elders and family members dealing with mental illness including depression which many, many people will experience some time during their life.

How do we do it?

Reduce easy access to dangerous substances at home. That includes:

Firearms - Because firearms are the most lethal among suicide methods, it is particularly important that you remove them until things improve at home, or, second best, lock them very securely.

Medications - Don't keep lethal doses at home. Your local Poison Control Center can give you information about what constitutes a lethal dose for the medicines you need to keep. Be particularly aware of keeping prescription painkillers (such as oxycodone and methadone) under lock and key both because of their lethality and their potential for abuse.

Alcohol - Alcohol can both increase the chance that a person makes an unwise choice, like attempting suicide, and increase the lethality of a drug overdose. Keep only small quantities at home.

The How to Specifics-Firearms

(Adapted by the Harvard School of Public Health from Maine Youth Suicide Prevention Program )

A lethal weapon available to a person in the depths of despair can end a life in an instant! Firearms are used in five out of ten suicides in the U.S. Removing lethal means from a vulnerable person, especially a youth, can save a life. It's like keeping the car keys away from a person who has had too much to drink.

Who Can Help Store or Dispose of a Firearm?

Some law enforcement departments (not all) will take firearms. Some offer temporary storage, some offer permanent disposal options, and some offer both. First, call your local police department, sheriff or state police. Identify yourself and explain your concern. Ask for the Officer on Duty; write down his/her name and the department's name. Arrange with the officer a time and location for him/her to pick up the firearm, if they offer that service. Do not bring the firearm to the police department unless told to by the Officer on Duty.

Does the Firearm Need to Be Ready to Go in a Certain Way?

If you know how to safely unload the firearm, unload it. If you do not know how to unload the firearm, tell the Officer before he/she arrives to pick it up. If the Officer asks you to bring the firearm to the police station, name who will bring it, what the person looks like, and the time the person will arrive.

What Happens to the Firearm?

The gun owner and the Officer will complete some paperwork. What happens next depends on the department. If the owner no longer wants it, some departments may have it melted down while others may sell it. Departments that offer temporary storage may have different policies regarding how to retrieve it (e.g., if applicable in your state, the gun owner may need to bring in a valid firearm owner ID card).

What if Law Enforcement Storage or Disposal Isn't an Option?

-Temporarily store the firearm at the home of a trusted relative or friend. Be sure the person at risk cannot get the firearm before or after it is removed. NOTE: Not all people can hold the guns for you. Check the list of prohibited persons under federal law.
-Lock the unloaded firearm in a gun safe or tamper-proof storage box with ammunition locked in a separate location. (BETTER YET, don't keep ammunition at home.)
-Trigger locks are sold in sporting goods stores and where firearms are sold. Some police departments offer free locks.
-Be sure the keys and storage box combinations are kept away from the person at risk. Remember: This does not guarantee safety. Youths generally know their parents' hiding places.
-Do not place the firearm in a bank safe deposit box. Most states have laws that prohibit carrying a weapon into federally insured buildings such as banks.
-Sell the firearm following the appropriate legal guidelines.

The How to Specifics-Meds

Avoid Storing Lethal Quantities of Medications in the home.

-Find and Locate prescription Medications in the home.
-Dispose of any not in use at the time.
-Consider keeping very small quantities of over the counter drugs available and keep larger quantities under lock and key.
-Find out what the lethal dosage is for each active prescription and keep larger amounts under lock and key.
-Most pharmacists are willing to provide you with counseling on these matters and you can also call your local poison control center.
-Do not order by mail in super quantities.

Behavior changes in your loved ones that may indicate an intent to use Medications for suicide or other inappropriate uses:

-Watch for doctor shopping or unusually high numbers of visits in your loved one or friend.
-Watch for the accumulation of unfilled paper prescriptions.
-Hoarding of medications, such as pain medications, long after the event that prompted the prescription has passed.

Disposal of Medications

Borrowed from a Vermont Department of Health Factsheet:

Prescription medications should not be flushed down the toilet or poured down the drain. To properly dispose of prescription medications, use the following guidelines:

Take unused, unneeded or expired prescription and over-the-counter drugs out of their original containers.

Mix the prescription drugs with an undesirable substance (used kitty litter, coffee grounds, soil, etc.), place the mixture into a sealable plastic bag or container, and place it into the trash. Please choose an undesirable substance that pets won’t want to eat.

When discarding a transdermal patch, fold the patch into itself and then place it in the undesirable mixture.

Choice

Despite or should I say in spite of Questioning Song's remarks from last night's FHE, I really don't think I experience sexualtiy in a "Homo" way. But it's also very clear to me that I experience something more than "Straight" sexuality, whatever we are going to call that.

The way I experience sexuality would actually support the "homosexuality is a choice" line of thought. At this point, I've heard (well read) over and over that others do not see their sexuality as a choice. My brother in law was like me and when he finally experienced sexual attraction, he experienced it to both sexes, but later clearly felt a preference for men. On the other hand, my friend John had lived with and loved a man for over ten years but was willing to consider marriage to a woman. So my closest real life contacts who had actually lived their lives with substantial amounts of homosexual conduct did not speak so very forcefully against the choice idea as they might have. So given this place I find myself in, I really don't find the argument that homosexual conduct is a choice distressing.

Given how I progressed to this point, I actually wonder if many, many more people experience their sexuality in the same way I do, with quite a bit of fluidity. Could this be why so many people are continue to argue that homosexuality is a choice? Because this is the way great numbers of people actually experience their sexuality? And, this raises its own set of questions again as to how I should deal with Questioning Song and his sexuality which may be quite different than mine in the long run.

Then I look back on this long marriage and I find myself saying well what about this, and when that happened remember how I lonely I felt, and why, and how, how rigid is that, or I would like it this way, and I can't help but wonder how many issues partners in mixed orientation marriages would have had anyway even if both parties were straight? And, yes, we can constrict this to the purely sexual arena and I still find those questions arising for me. I have been through so much and so has DH that other people find indicative as problems arising out of one partner's sexuality and it's just not computing that way for me. Long term marriages have varying phases with differing levels of intimacy.

The Song Family Gets Ready for Prom

Tonight we had our first get ready for Two Guys and a Prom night by watching this video of the Horstmanschoff's family's experience with homosexuality for Family Home Evening. It was a little long. All independent filmmakers do this, they inflict too much information on their viewers. Baby Song said, "Weird." Questioning Song said, "Thank God you're kind of a Homo, too!" and DH said, "Does this mean I can have a second wife?"

Young Men and Young Women

No one asked me, but as a parent, I'm not really satisfied with either the Scouting Program or the Young Women's program. But, I don't dislike these programs either. Yes, I've heard people testify that these programs are inspired, and they may be, but more likely they are a product of our wonderful correlation committee, instigation of which was a huge blessing to the membership whether inspired or not.

Scouting is a rather odd phenomenom which can manifest in strange ways. The relationship between the Boy Scouts and the LDS Church and Homosexuality seems to be caught in a self-reinforcing cycle. I found Rex's post interesting to say the least. Understand that number one Song, is an Eagle, and even questioning Song did quite a bit of scouting, and that baby Song will probably go forward in Scouting quite a way. Girl Song really resented not being able to be a Boy Scout, but of course she was always upset about every thing her brother got to do that she didn't. Quiet Song is technically an adult scouter, and while she thinks that avowed homosexual quite surely doesn't include a heterosexual with some homosexuality, she finds the line quite arbitrary.

I do like the personal progress program in concept, and now that it is open to every woman not just the girls, I'm going to finish mine. Just as I don't get crafting in Relief Society, remember my idea of a great way to spend a day making something right now is replicating found objects in cast iron, I'm not entirely on board with the remainder of the young women's program, except for Girl's camp. I OWE a lot to Girl's Camp.

In the early 1900's one of the achievements for girl's included clearing a 1/4 acre of brush. Some things do change . . . Where's my bandelero?

Blaming the Bishop-Heavens to Mergatroid, Betsy!

Previously, I've posted here and here about the recent passing of my Drama Mama and not so much about the family schism she partially purposefully and partially unwittingly engineered a few weeks before passing. I've also written about the family proprensity to play the blame game and how I sometimes slip into that old habit largely caused by bad family of origin conditioning. As though receiving an email from my mother's email account with no explanation whatsoever that had a pdf attachment of a tacky funeral announcement was not enough, there is now a facebook posting accusing Drama Mama's bishop of directing a third party to steal the family jewels.

Oh, my. What next?

How was it possible to so get the facts so incredibly mixed up (I actually do have most of the facts and the finger points to the nutzoids' agent in the matter and the bishop was not even remotely involved) and so avoid the personal responsibility that actually dwells somewhere other than Drama Mama's poor bishop who had actually zero to do with any part of this?

Onward and forward to another day . . . and, thanks to all those folks willing to serve and who unwittingly take some of the collateral damage.